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Posted by ameijers on August 28, 2005, 4:39 am
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Apologies in advance if this group is supposed to be for working pros only.
Subject says it all, almost. Finally bought a house, and hooked up all the
various computers, real Ma Bell phones, satt receiver, answering machine,
etc. Ran into problems- some of the 2500s couldn't break dial tone, poor
connections on the modems, etc. Only reliable way to make things work is
unplug devices down to 4 or less. Testing at demarc with laptop, I only get
40k, since I am so far from telco. Inside, by itself, laptop gets 40k on any
jack if it is the sole device connected. I do have most of the ringers
disconnected to keep the REN total as low as possible. Or does REN really
apply to the device itself, not just the ringing function?
Note that I did have all the same junk hooked up in my previous apartment,
and it all worked, albeit slowly, behind multiple pedestals and punchdown
blocks.
Inside wiring at the new place is 4-color solid untwisted. I have snugged or
redone all the splices in basement, and snugged all the wall jacks. They
used the original inside 4-post wiring block as a junction block front-fed
from new demarc, till posts got full, then switched to floating-in-air
gunk-filled Scotchlok crimp connectors for the additional branches. It is a
mess.
Yes, I would prefer a home-run wired 110 block or patch panel with cat 5e,
but before I go the expense and bother, is it likely to gain me anything,
since the connection is only so-so at the demarc? Ma Bell (SBC) already ran
onsite diagnostics for me, and claims the drop is fine. (Not to mention, no
place around here sells real connection hardware, just the made-in-china
plastic crap, or faux modular patch panels for 'system' wiring. I'd have to
hire the work out, or spend a couple hundred online ordering the the real
parts and cable and punchdown tool for a one-time requirement.)
I know - I should just get broadband, but DSL isn't available this far out,
and cable modem is horribly overpriced locally.
any advice or tips greatly appreciated.
aem sends...
aemeijers@att.net
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Posted by Floyd L. Davidson on August 28, 2005, 8:33 am
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>Inside wiring at the new place is 4-color solid untwisted.
=========
None of the remedies you tried will correct that problem!
Rewire the house. Run CAT5 cable everywhere. Pull enough to
run not just your telephone lines, but at least a couple of
10baseT Ethernet links to each room. Or do it right and pull
enough cable for two phones and two Ethernet links in each
*corner* of every room!
>I have snugged or
>redone all the splices in basement, and snugged all the wall jacks. They
>used the original inside 4-post wiring block as a junction block front-fed
>from new demarc, till posts got full, then switched to floating-in-air
>gunk-filled Scotchlok crimp connectors for the additional branches. It is a
>mess.
And it won't work.
>Yes, I would prefer a home-run wired 110 block or patch panel with cat 5e,
>but before I go the expense and bother, is it likely to gain me anything,
>since the connection is only so-so at the demarc?
Everything you described fits the wiring you've indicated. With
untwisted pairs you will have crosstalk to anything and
everything (power wiring, between telephone wires, to Ethernet
cabling, etc). E.g., it will pick up noise every time any
electrical switch is turned on or off anywhere in the house.
My bet is that you don't get the same sustained data transfer
rates in the house with everything hooked up that you do with
the laptop connected right at the demarc. Note that the initial
connect speed merely shows that it *can* be good, not that it
stays that good for hours on end.
>Ma Bell (SBC) already ran
>onsite diagnostics for me, and claims the drop is fine. (Not to mention, no
How can it be fine if some phones won't break dial tone???? You
*should* be able to connect several extentions. The only limit
should be when there are too many ringers and some of them won't
*ring*... but all of them should be able to break dialtone.
That doesn't mean they should all work well if more than one is
offhook at a time though. They might, or might not. But each
one, when onhook, does *nothing* to change the line for any
purpose other than ringing.
Who ever did the "diagnostics" didn't do much... ;-)
>place around here sells real connection hardware, just the made-in-china
>plastic crap, or faux modular patch panels for 'system' wiring. I'd have to
>hire the work out, or spend a couple hundred online ordering the the real
>parts and cable and punchdown tool for a one-time requirement.)
You are better off spending a couple hundred online. You'll get
a better price anyway. And both a punchdown tool plus a
crimping tool for RJ-45 connectors are good things to have when
you want to add or change something. Put a piece of 1/2" or
5/8" plywood on the wall where you want all this to be centered,
and have a hook there for the tools too. Mount the 110 blocks
and make it look like a pro did it!
>I know - I should just get broadband, but DSL isn't available this far out,
>and cable modem is horribly overpriced locally.
Part of the reason for running CAT5 (rather than CAT2) is because
some day that will change, and you will want to use the house wiring
for Ethernet.
>any advice or tips greatly appreciated.
--
Floyd L. Davidson <http://www.apaflo.com/floyd_davidson>
Ukpeagvik (Barrow, Alaska) floyd@apaflo.com
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Posted by David Lesher on August 28, 2005, 5:11 pm
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>Apologies in advance if this group is supposed to be for working pros only.
>Subject says it all, almost. Finally bought a house, and hooked up all the
>various computers, real Ma Bell phones, satt receiver, answering machine,
>etc. Ran into problems- some of the 2500s couldn't break dial tone, poor
>connections on the modems, etc. Only reliable way to make things work is
>unplug devices down to 4 or less. Testing at demarc with laptop, I only get
>40k, since I am so far from telco. Inside, by itself, laptop gets 40k on any
>jack if it is the sole device connected. I do have most of the ringers
>disconnected to keep the REN total as low as possible. Or does REN really
>apply to the device itself, not just the ringing function?
REN is ringers, period. Nothing should alter pulling dial tone.
The modem speed with your laptop is irrelevent; when connected at the
demark it refects the condition of the outside loop plant and loop card;
be it in a SLC or the CO.
Either your IW is farkeled [engineering term] or one or more of your
devices is. I bet the wiring.
Connect all your gadgets up right at the demark. What happens?
>I know - I should just get broadband, but DSL isn't available this far out,
>and cable modem is horribly overpriced locally.
You might look for jacks that got wet and corroded.
Unplug everything and measure the resistance tip to ring from the
demark looking INTO the house. It should be 100Kohms or better. If
that's good, short tip to ring there, and go jack-to-jack and measure
the resistance of the loop. {Make up a modular cord for the ohmmeter}
It should be only a few ohms.
--
A host is a host from coast to coast.................wb8foz@nrk.com
& no one will talk to a host that's close........[v].(301) 56-LINUX
Unless the host (that isn't close).........................pob 1433
is busy, hung or dead....................................20915-1433
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Posted by ameijers on August 28, 2005, 8:37 pm
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>
(snip)
> Either your IW is farkeled [engineering term] or one or more of your
> devices is. I bet the wiring.
>
> Connect all your gadgets up right at the demark. What happens?
>
> >I know - I should just get broadband, but DSL isn't available this far
out,
> >and cable modem is horribly overpriced locally.
>
> You might look for jacks that got wet and corroded.
Nothing obvious from visual inspection, but I realize that doesn't always
mean much. No painless way to plug anything other than laptop or a desk set
into the demarc- need to find my box of spare cables, and see if I still
have a 50-foot rj11.
>
> Unplug everything and measure the resistance tip to ring from the
> demark looking INTO the house. It should be 100Kohms or better. If
> that's good, short tip to ring there, and go jack-to-jack and measure
> the resistance of the loop. {Make up a modular cord for the ohmmeter}
> It should be only a few ohms.
>
Thanks- I'll try that when I find the box with my VOM in it, and my box of
extra rj11 pigtails and such.... (unpacking is a LOT more tedious than I
remember. And the lawn keeps growing...)
aem sends....
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Posted by John McHarry on August 28, 2005, 10:35 pm
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On Sun, 28 Aug 2005 17:11:19 +0000, David Lesher wrote:
> Unplug everything and measure the resistance tip to ring from the
> demark looking INTO the house. It should be 100Kohms or better. If
> that's good, short tip to ring there, and go jack-to-jack and measure
> the resistance of the loop. {Make up a modular cord for the ohmmeter}
> It should be only a few ohms.
If that doesn't do it, consider adding a battery in series with the line.
Telcos sometimes do that when they can't get enough loop current. I think
you need 17ma to trip off-hook, but it has been a few years. You might
have to bypass the battery with a couple capacitors.
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